#43 - The Power of Investing in High-Performing Multifamily Real Estate Properties with Viking Capital

[00:00:00] The information contained herein is intended to help the viewer successfully navigate common IRS and Department of Labor requirements to help achieve successful results from their IRA. The information is not intended to replace information from your legal counsel or income tax professional. IRA Club does not offer or sell any investment. All investments have risk. This is the Investor's Row Podcast, powered by the IRA Club. Alternative investing reimagined.

[00:00:24] Whether you're a seasoned investor or just getting started, we're here to empower you to take control of your financial future and unlock the power of your self-directed retirement accounts. Let's get started. Welcome back to another Investors Row Podcast with your host, Ramez Fakouri, where we always talk things related to retirement accounts, in particular, the self-directed space. Real estate has always been one of those alternative assets in our world that we heavily preach.

[00:00:52] We see about 80% of our IRA Club clients investing in this specific asset class. And it doesn't necessarily have to be a hard, tangible asset, right? It could be multiple different real estate opportunities, whether it's multifamily, it could be a syndication. It could be a hard, tangible asset like a house on 123 Green Street, commercial, mixed-used, or a private equity deal, right?

[00:01:15] So, the one thing I will tell you as a landlord myself is I own 16 residential units, and sometimes I can't stand them. In fact, I pass it off to the property management company, and I know that my co-host, Chris, is laughing on the other line for a specific reason, because I don't want to get those phone calls in the middle of the night where my toilet broke, the AC is not working, especially on a day like today in Chicago, where it's 110 degrees with a heat index.

[00:01:42] And I always think, in my head, when investing in an alternative asset inside of a 401k or IRA, why would you not consider using a portion of those dollars, whether it's with Fidelity, Vanguard, or Schwab, to invest in an opportunity like multifamily? And that's what we're here to talk about today, right? And in our podcast, Investors Pro, we talk about, again, all things related towards alternatives.

[00:02:08] And a good friend, somebody that I've known for almost, I would say, a decade now, right, Chris? It's been a little bit. First time we met, and remember the first time we met was at, I think it was the Peak Partnership event. It was their very first one. So, actually, I will take that back. It's been about almost eight years, right? Because they're on their eighth year. So, that was the very first time I met Chris. And I was very intrigued. And his story is very fascinating.

[00:02:35] But before I jump into that, you are a... I'm the Senior VP of Capital Markets, and I head up Investor Relations. Viking Capital is no stranger to IRA Club. You are part of the Investors Row platform, where a lot of our IRA Club members look and want to diversify a portion of their retirement dollars. You, as an organization, the company itself, have now, I think, a little over a billion dollars, right, assets under administration. Not to mention, I think, liquidity are about 330.

[00:03:05] Correct me if I'm wrong. That's correct. That is a huge and monster number in our space. So, congratulations to you guys. I know you guys have been around for well over 10 years, right? What's the official number now? 11. See? That's how I said. It's been about a decade. So, I was right. I was right. I hit the nail right on that. But tell me a little bit about your story. I know your story. But tell everybody that's listening a little bit about your story, how you got started. Talk a little bit about Viking Capital. But I want to jump right into it right after that.

[00:03:35] Yeah, absolutely. You know, I have a pretty unique story. I didn't anticipate working in real estate. So, for me, I always thought that I was going to be working in import-export work. I graduated with a degree in business and Chinese. I moved to China for a handful of years.

[00:03:53] And, like, in the strangest of outcomes, I got a job with a Chinese real estate firm who really just loved that I spoke Chinese and knew America and wanted me to help them. So, that's right. Chris, I don't want to interrupt this part of it because I think this is the funniest thing on the planet. So, as I got to know you, there was a Chinese investor that was at an event. And you started talking to him, I believe, in Mandarin, right? Yeah, that's right. And, guys, I paused. I'm like, wait.

[00:04:22] I looked at him and my jaw dropped and I go, wait, what nationality are you? And you and I started busting out laughing. So, I – And those things actually happen, like, all the time. The kind of serendipitous – people say things are supposed to happen the way they happen. Yeah. Like, one of – a random investor call I had a few months ago was someone that not only went to the University of Florida like I did, also went to the Chinese university that I went to. Wow.

[00:04:51] They were dual alumni in the same schools. And he was randomly brought into the Viking capital sphere. But, yeah. So, you know, I find myself in China not really thinking about real estate. A real estate firm hired me and I worked with them for a little bit.

[00:05:10] And ultimately, when I moved back stateside, what got me my first, you know, real taste of institutional real estate and real estate mentorship was the fact that I spoke Chinese and I worked with a high net worth Chinese family office. And that skill set made me attractive to the American private equity market. So, a group hired me out of California. I worked with them for almost 10 years.

[00:05:38] And they focused on raising capital in China. They were developing a hotel with a Chinese developer. Yeah. And it was kind of the perfect fit. And those guys, Larry Cosma and Jonathan Curtis, taught me everything I know about real estate. Shout out. And like created the person that you know today. You know, when I left that firm, and I always feel, I always do my best to leave a position better than I found it. So, I still always work with the people that I, I never really leave.

[00:06:07] Like you're, you're an alumni of that group and you always kind of find ways to work together. And that's the way to do business, especially in real estate. Never burn a bridge. That's exactly it. But I found myself leaving hotel development and hospitality development, assisted living. That's what we were developing in Southern California. And we worked on some big projects. We built the JW Marriott in Anaheim. We built the W Hotel in Hollywood. We built another couple hotels in Almonte with the Chinese developers.

[00:06:35] And I found myself shifting in 2017 from hotel development into multifamily acquisition. And, and there was no real reason to move. We were raising capital through the EB5 program in that sunset. So, I started working for another company in South Florida. Learned a lot about multifamily. And then what happens? Serendipity again. COVID happens.

[00:07:01] Hotel developers, hotel acquisition folks go through like one of the most challenging times in market history. And, and I find myself in a new market in 2017, you know, and COVID was actually good for multifamily, right? Because people pay their rent. You know, people stop going to hotels. People stop going to conferences. People aren't traveling as much. But people paid their rent.

[00:07:27] And even though it was challenging and there was an eviction moratorium, it was then that I really saw the value and how well insulated multifamily, especially at scale. Like you can scale this as a passive investor or as an active investor, depending on how much brain damage you'd like. And that, that's really when it kind of hit me. And when I left that role, that the company I started at in multifamily was a group called Pia Residential in South Florida. Great group.

[00:07:56] Same thing, you know, connected with those guys will be for the rest of my life. And the, the big difference between Pia Residential and Viking Capital was Pia is not really interested in the individual investor. They wanted the $5 million check from a family office. They wanted an institutional partner that was going to bring a single check. And, and that was great. That's kind of the world that I lived in. Fantastic working them, working with them for, for a few years.

[00:08:23] And what really stood out to me about Viking was, Hey, I had pitched to my firm at the time, the idea that we should partner with the IRA clubs of the world. We should partner with individual folks and build this ecosystem where we aren't reliant on the one check. Because everyone that's using syndicated capital, everyone that's using country club money, the grass is always greener, right?

[00:08:49] So they're always looking up and saying, man, it'd be so great if I had a $5 million check or, oh man, it'd be great if I was going to do this $85 million deal and someone's going to stroke me a $35 million check. Well, guess what? Money always comes with strength. So the higher you go up that totem pole, the less money you're going to make. And the harder it's going to be because the people that are writing the biggest check, you know, he who has the gold makes the rules, right? So you were going to, and it's easier for you.

[00:09:16] If you're not going out and finding a thousand investors to build a syndicate with, one guy's writing a check, that's taken off your plate. You can focus on what you do best. There's lots of reasons to do both. My vision for every company I've worked at is let's not be married to one bucket of capital. Let's build multiple buckets of capital because there are going to be times where high net worth folks are really interested in placing capital. There's going to be times where high net worth folks are very fearful and they're not going to place a lot of capital.

[00:09:46] Same thing with institutions. Institutions are big, clunky machines. It has to be very obvious for them to write a $30 million check. So when things are not obvious and you're having to take a little bit more risk, institutions go pencil down. So that's been my vision at Viking. And we really created something special, I believe, because we have a subset of family offices that will write those bigger checks. We have some institutional partners that will write a single check.

[00:10:13] Then we also have built, when I got to Viking, there were about 275 individual high net worth investors that were friends and family of the founders. They brought me on to scale that. And over almost five years, I've scaled that to 1,200 individual investor, investor groups, plus family offices, plus institutions. And now we're going to go to the back door of retail capital. Listen, don't jump too far ahead, Chris. We're going to get into that.

[00:10:44] Or later, there is another bucket of capital that I'm really excited about. There is. I don't mean to steal your thunder, but we're definitely going to be talking about that because I'm proud of you guys. I mean, when you get to that level, that just means you guys, I don't want to say the word made it, but made it. And you know where I'm going to go with that in a split second. But to take a step back, who are the two principal partners? You just mentioned that there were two principal partners. Who are they? Or one, forgive me, I could be mistaken. Well, yeah.

[00:11:13] So there were two founders of Viking Capital. You have Vikram Raya and you have Ravi Gupta. Recently, Ravi Gupta has kind of moved more into the owner's box. And Vikram acting as a CEO is really making all of the decisions for the firm. God bless you. Yeah, Vik's a good dude. I've known him for a long time. We run around the same circles. Viking Capital, obviously, real estate is your focus, your forte. This is what you guys do. So talk to us a little bit about the process.

[00:11:43] Like when you, I mean, what does that process look like when determining what asset or piece of real estate, right? That acquisitions process, like where do you guys focus on typically? Like what states, what areas? And it does shift. Historically, Viking's core business has been done in Atlanta. If you want a broader decision, kind of lay out the Sun Belt plus Texas.

[00:12:09] But we're not immune to venturing out to areas that have a great story or a great narrative. And we see an opportunity. So actually, two of the highest performing assets in our portfolio are in South Bend, Indiana. And that's not, that's one of the benefits of having the different buckets of capital is if you're working with an institution, it's like, okay, you're going to buy in Orlando, you're going to buy in Dallas, you're going to buy in Chicago. Like they need that as part of their story.

[00:12:35] When you have more flexible capital, you're able to get in there into the nooks and crannies and find, you know, the better cap rates, find the tertiary cities where you're actually going to be able to have a little bit more skin in the game for LPs. So I wanted to ask, how many units are you guys currently managing? It's right under 5,500. I think it's like 5,350 or 5,400. Oh, wow. That's okay. That's a significant number. Obviously higher at certain points.

[00:13:00] But you, you currently, are you structured as a fund, right? Did you? So we have done a fund in the past. We are currently kind of in the go-to-market strategy for a new fund. And, but a lot of our business is single asset SPVs. What we found was the bigger buckets of capital really love the fund structure because they really, the sophistication level is higher.

[00:13:28] They understand the diversity and they do a diversification and they really focus on due diligence on the front end. Some of the smaller investors, you know, they're like, well, look, we met you three weeks ago because Rama sent you over and said you were someone we should talk to. You know, we're not really interested in putting money into a fund where we can't do due diligence.

[00:13:46] But do you have a deal where we could dip our toe in the water and see how you guys perform, see what your reporting looks like and get a good feeling before we, and honestly, some of our largest investors, I'll be honest with you, started out as a Facebook lead. Their first investment was 50,000 bucks. Wow. And the next one is 500,000. The next one is 3 million.

[00:14:07] Well, to be clear, Chris, Rama's can never send leads or clients over because, you know, as a self-directed IRA company, we can never choose the investment for the investor. We can't talk about the investment opportunity. You know that firsthand. But I know you were trying to go with that.

[00:14:23] But just for those that are listening for the first time, if you're not familiar with the concept of using a portion of your retirement dollars to invest, one of the rules and regulations here at the IRA Club is nobody could ever talk about that investment opportunity. I would tell you that there are, because we run in the same circles, I think that's where Chris is more so referring to.

[00:14:45] But again, and again, you know, I think Chris nailed this a little bit or just touched on it a little bit where we are a strategy to Chris as another avenue, right, where Chris knows this. And he's a huge advocate of retirement accounts. Why not tap into $45 trillion that most Americans don't realize that they could use a portion of their money to invest in these type of real estate deals?

[00:15:10] Like we talked a lot about why not give the average Joe, right, or the person that can get, you know, access to these institutional type funds. That's where Chris comes into place. And that's where Chris helps a lot of the IRA Club clients that he actually brings over here. I was about to say, it's actually probably quite the reverse is I send people that want to use their IRA funds to Ramez and then they just find their way back to me. Yep, yep. And here's the truth.

[00:15:37] Chris knows that he needs to use me at the end of the day as part of his strategy. And Chris will literally ask a very generic question. Do you have retirement dollars? And the answer is always yes, Chris. Chris knows that. Well, did you know that you could use $100,000 or $200,000 of this retirement account to invest in this specific deal that we're currently going after? Whatever the case may be. So, and I thank you for that, Chris, for actually being an educator first and foremost.

[00:16:04] You know, most people just don't understand it. They can't grasp it. And I think one of the things that you love about IRA Club is we are going to do the handholding for your clients, right? We're going to walk them through that opening phase. We're going to fund the account for them and they've already identified the investment opportunity through you. But I want to take it to that next step further where I told you don't steal my thunder a split second ago. You've made it to where now you are officially working with a broker-dealer. Yeah. Elaborate on that a little bit.

[00:16:34] What has that been like? This is the new fund that we're setting up. You know, we still do single asset SPVs. But think of it this way. With our largest clients, the folks that have been with us for years. The only interactions I ever have with their registered investment advisors are like they kind of we bump heads, right?

[00:16:58] Because they're looking at it and the way that I'm looking at it is like, wow, I would like to build a relationship with your client. Your client trusts you and you don't have the ability to invest in my offering on your platform. So what ends up happening is there's this really awkward phone call where all three of us are on there. You have to kind of break the ice and talk to the elephant in the room, which is you don't really want to lose your client's funds. You know, they're interested in investing with me.

[00:17:28] Let's talk about the risk. And what I found is that when I actually diffuse the situation, explain that we're not trying to kind of rip away, you know, their clients, but we want to collaborate. We want to build this system where a lot of times the RIAs actually don't know a lot about alternatives. So I end up educating both the RIA and the investor, but they know finance and they know how to protect capital and build and preserve wealth.

[00:17:55] So when you build this ecosystem, what I found is every time I get off the phone, the investor usually invests and the RIA usually calls me a couple days later and says, hey, can I steal some of your time to learn more about this? I have other clients. So we devised a plan to say, like, how do we how do we start working with RIAs as well? And going down that rabbit hole has been fascinating. It is a completely different world. A different world.

[00:18:21] Going straight to director, going one to many instead of one to one is not only is it unique and challenging. And challenging. There's a game plan to do it, but it actually protects the investor so much, much more. Yes. And that's something that, like, you know, I've told all of our internal investors. I was like, guys, there's another way to invest in alternatives through an RIA where the RIA gets a huge benefit.

[00:18:51] And we brought a few RIAs onto our platform to talk to our investors and potentially get clients because we do collaborate. Yeah. Yeah. So here, Chris, and the reason why I'm super stoked about this is you and I about six months ago, seven, eight, nine. I forgot what it was. It was about seven, eight months ago. And you actually called me up and you said, what do you think about this idea about working with a broker dealer? Right. And really been focused on RIAs.

[00:19:18] And for those that don't understand the term, RIA stands for registered investment advisor. Keep in mind, when you've heard me speak in the past on this podcast, we don't have a problem with fiduciaries and registered investment advisors here at the IRA club. Okay. They are a little bit different. I like to call them cousins, right? They're cousins, but they do things a little bit differently. How so?

[00:19:44] So for those that work with fiduciaries, you're typically, they have a securities license, which is a series six or series seven. Most people do. Most fiduciaries have that and they have to do what's in the best interest of the client. But these licenses are typically held with, and I'm just going to use this example of with a broker dealer, like let's say a Fidelity Vanguard or Schwab. So let's just say I am a fiduciary with a series six or seven.

[00:20:10] That means I could only sell the broker dealers products that are within this investment frame, right? This world of what they have, which is traditionally stocks, bonds, mutual funds, ETFs, sometimes REITs, right? Sometimes they do have private placement deals at Fidelity. They're rare, and typically the minimums are like a half a million dollars or more, and they're reserved for high net worth individuals, which sometimes I feel is not fair. Now, what Chris is talking about, the RIA world, right?

[00:20:40] They typically have something called a series 65 or 66. They are what I like to call freelancers. And let's just say they work, let's say with Charles Schwab, but they also have the flexibility to take a portion of the money that they're representing this client. They could take a portion of the money from Charles Schwab, and they could do alternative investment deals with a different broker if they choose to do so. Now, a lot of these RIAs love IRA Club.

[00:21:09] We have over 1,000 RIAs that utilize our services. That's why I was telling Chris we work with about 20-plus broker dealers that specialize in what Chris actually does, right, which is private equity deals. He exposes these deals to the RIAs. Why do I like this so much? One of the things I preach all the time to all IRA Club members and anybody that's listening is if you are going to use a portion of your retirement dollars, you better do some due diligence, okay?

[00:21:39] Now, with a broker dealer, Chris, elaborate on what that process looks like on due diligence and that facet. So tell our listeners how crazy this could be. Oh, yeah. It's invasive. And it should be, right? Because think of it this way. When you work with a broker dealer, not only are they coming in and creating a due diligence package, they're taking on liability. Yes.

[00:22:07] So that is why I think that they do a much better job than just an RIA who is helping their client because, of course, they're going to do their best. But ultimately, if the investment fails, the RIA that did you a favor and reviewed the product isn't on the hook for it not panning out.

[00:22:27] If a managing broker dealer goes in and does due diligence and gives a report that says, we checked all these things, their due diligence failed, they actually take on liability of not being able to uncover what they should have uncovered during that due diligence. And that's really important that that really protects investors. I'm sorry, just to keep in mind. So this checklist is very, to his point, rigorous. They want to know everything about the principal partners.

[00:22:58] They want to know they will disclose every dollar that's coming in, every dollar that's coming out. And it's general public. People could actually see this. And they have to disclose this, meaning Chris and his team at Viking, right? So that is huge. And that's it. It's like a laundry list of formation documents, succession planning, what happens if one of the principals dies.

[00:23:20] Like any question that you could think of in like a keyword search or a checklist that you could download that says, how do I protect myself about doing due diligence on a sponsor? The managing broker dealer is like working that sponsor through those things. And then to even further provide due diligence, you usually work with a third party outside of your broker dealer. And that could be like a FactRight or a MicLaw, which we're going with FactRight.

[00:23:50] They'll have a report that the general public doesn't get to see. So they're going to go in and they're going to battle test our track record. And is our track record? Did it accomplish what we said it accomplished in our track record book? They're actually going in and confirming all of that stuff. And they're giving a report based off of the risk factors that they have done through their due diligence. And they'll do it at the sponsor level and at the deal level. And then they will make that report only available to RIAs. That is, you guys.

[00:24:20] I can't actually send it to you if I wanted to. You'd have to go to your RIA and only your RIA could get access to it. If you're working with an RIA. If you're working with an RIA. If you're working with that. Which, by the way, Chris, you have no idea how much I appreciate this. So, again, kudos to you for taking that step forward. I think that was the next evolution anyways of Viking Capital. You guys were getting so big. So, again, I'm giving you a clap for taking that step. And for those that are listening, I talk to so many people. Chris, you know this. At events.

[00:24:51] And these are all private equity deals. And companies that are looking for accredited investors that do not want to work with a broker-dealer. Right? Like, where did you come up with this information? Oh, you know, I met this guy at a family barbecue. And I'm just, like, shaking my head. You're shaking. You're looking at me like, yeah, you're right. Because you've witnessed this firsthand. And I shake my head.

[00:25:20] I'm like, guys, spend $500. Do a thorough background check. I don't care if you use Thomas Reuters. Go on the Agder SEC website. Fine. He's not working with a broker-dealer. And Chris has taken all of that already and upfront disclosed that. That, A, we want to make sure that you are so comfortable, right, that we are trusted. And I'm not endorsing you because I can't.

[00:25:42] But it's just a breath of fresh air for somebody like me that is constantly battling this, number one, educating. Two, why did you not do this? And you lost $150,000 from your 401k or IRA. Because you didn't take that necessary step. So on Investor's Row, you know this. And when I say I work with about 20-plus broker-dealers, a lot of the investment opportunities are either a hard, tangible asset where you can't lose it.

[00:26:10] Or they're associated with a broker-dealer. Because I, Ramis Fakori, feel a little bit more comfortable. Not all of them, but I would say the majority of them. Because we are trying our best to protect our clients at the end of the day. And no, even if you are, Chris, working with a broker-dealer, no past performance is going to guarantee. The broker-dealer can't even guarantee that, right?

[00:26:32] So I just want people to understand that it's just another level of due diligence, security, whatever it is, before taking a portion of your retirement dollars. And by the way, I keep saying retirement dollars. This is even your personal funds. But I want you to diversify both sides. Whether it's your personal or retirement dollars, why not take a portion? Chris, you know, one of the things that we didn't talk about with the new fund is it – what is the minimum on the new fund, just out of curiosity? So somebody had $250,000 at Fidelity, Vin, wanted to do this.

[00:27:00] Yeah, it's a bit higher than typical. Usually our minimum was $50,000 on the individual SPVs. It's going to be $100,000, but it's still approachable to your typical accredited investor. Our broker-dealer actually pushed us to raise it to like $250,000 or $500,000. But Chris, that's a favor to me because you're on investor's row. If someone has $50,000 in their IRA or 401K, you're going to do me a favor? Right.

[00:27:29] Yeah, well, and the thing is that Viking's ethos isn't just going after the big check. Like it was a company built from – a lot of the founding investors were people that worked with Vic and Ravi at the hospitals. They were both doctors when they started the firm. Yeah. Now the people that run the firm are more real estate folks than physicians. But that is a big chunk of our investor base.

[00:27:55] And the goal here was always to educate people on how to evaluate risk, to match their risk appetite with what we might have to offer, and make sure that you're making decisions that you at least know what you're investing and how it works, what has to happen for you to lose all your money, what has to happen for you to hit the projected returns or higher. And anyone that sits in my seat and tells you that real estate's not hard and anyone can do it – Full of shit.

[00:28:24] Like there are so many things on a daily basis that come up that no matter how proactive you are, one of your buildings might catch on fire. Insurance might triple in price. There's lots of things that – COVID, who thought we'd have an eviction moratorium? So doing due diligence is always important. But, you know, you – I think the most important thing in real estate is finding a collection of sponsors that you trust.

[00:28:51] And knowing that they're trustworthy people and things aren't always going to go right, but you feel like that the leaders and the principals of the sponsorship group that you're investing in, you're really investing in them and their ethics more than you're investing in the underlying real estate. And that's always one thing I would say about you, Chris, and Vic and the team over there at Viking is, you know, again, it's just your – the way that you guys position yourself,

[00:29:16] the way you guys talk to investors, to these physicians, doctors that I actually meet at events with you guys, you know, you guys are not pushy at all. It's just like let me just show you. Let me educate you on this, this, this, this, this, and then I want you to make an educated decision, right? Because, again, I always tell people you're dealing with your nest eggs, you know, when using retirement dollars. So I give you guys great credit for that, by the way.

[00:29:46] One of the things that I actually want to – since we're talking about education, you guys actually have your own – I'm trying to promote you here, Chris. You guys have your own podcast. What is the name of that podcast? Yeah, it's called Wealth Unfiltered. And even though it's sponsored by Viking Capital, I wouldn't want anyone to think that you're going to go there and see like every deal we've done.

[00:30:08] In fact, you know, the podcast is really hosted by our director of marketing and my wife, Samantha Paranello. She's awesome. She brings on like the greatest minds in real estate. So you have the heads of CBRE. You have – I think, Ramez, you even did a podcast with her. I did one about a month ago, yeah. Yeah, you have like some really, really fantastic folks. Even a lot of times other sponsors that we just have met in the world that we think so highly about

[00:30:37] that we think with their secret sauce and the way they do their business is important for everyone to hear. So the podcast is really built about around educating people on wealth in general, wealth accumulation, and how you can educate yourself broadly, whether it's traditional equities or private equity. That's the goal of the podcast. And it's been really fun to participate in it. I love – by the way, fantastic podcast. Tell Samantha, great job, by the way.

[00:31:05] I actually – I didn't realize how deep my voice was until you actually like listen to yourself. I'm like, holy cow. I'm like, is she using like something that I'm not seeing AI generated? And I'm like, I wish she had a skinny filter on, by the way. Tell her to make sure that's on the next time I jump on. Not to go off topic, but what other avenues? What else are you guys doing as far as education? You guys still hosting your yearly or bi-yearly live events? Yeah.

[00:31:34] So we'll usually have at least one live event. It's usually – Vikram has his other company, Limitless MD, where he has a collection of high-performing physicians and other executives that are really getting to learn his mindset and how he built biking. And man, like I was a little bit skeptical at first because I've never been through a coaching environment, Tony Robbins or anything. But I usually join those as a speaker to give people an idea of who biking is.

[00:32:04] And really, I think what folks are getting in there is community. Like I see folks that have like taken down 1,500 units together all because they join the program. So really incredible. You know, I've invited some of our investors to those events just so they can kind of see how it works and all of that. And then, you know, as far as other education, you know, really just going to our website, bikingcapllc.com.

[00:32:28] Our marketing department puts out white papers, blog articles, videos. We put a lot of content out there and the content isn't accidental. It's not like we're just trying to think of what would be useful. I have thousands of conversations every month. And anytime somebody asks me questions and they're good questions and I see that they're grateful for the information, we have a really tight feedback loop between investor relations and marketing.

[00:32:56] So my team takes all of the information that every investor tells them that they wish they had or things where we see that there's gaps. And our marketing team delivers that to everybody through our marketing function. So, you know, we have a lot of folks that are on our email list. They listen to watch our newsletters. They visit our podcast. Many of them haven't invested with us and they just really like the information and they think it's a good source.

[00:33:20] So we invite everyone, you know, whether you're interested in placing capital or not, to come and learn. Yeah, just learn. That's the whole point and the reason why you and I do these types of podcasts. It's just I always say open up doors and opportunities for people. You know, networking, talking to each other, having conversations is the number one and ultimate thing that I'm always, even to my own team, I'm preaching. Right.

[00:33:45] It is at the end of the day, you know, with IRA Club, with you, we're not trying to sell you on anything, especially here at the IRA Club. We can't sell you anything. We're just a strategy. You have to use us at the end of the day to execute what it is that you want to do. And the only way to do that is through education and just getting the word out. But Chris, is there something else I'm missing that I should know about you that I don't already know about you besides you speak Mandarin?

[00:34:14] No, you know, I think, you know, personally, you know, kind of open book. I'd say the one unique thing, if you're looking for another unique thing like that, I grew up in the Marshall Islands. So that's something that, you know, many people don't know where the Marshall Islands are, but it's like smack dab in the South Pacific. So I spent a lot of time overseas. I think it kind of made me want to move to China.

[00:34:37] I think regarding real estate and Viking, I think that the part that I would encourage all of the listeners to really understand, to kind of help set themselves up for success, whether you invested at the end of this last cycle or whether you haven't, really going in and looking at what people thought was going to happen versus what happened. What was the effect when the Fed raised interest rates in 2022?

[00:35:06] What kind of adversity did that bring on? How did people handle it? I think, you know, over the last five years, you know, Viking didn't do everything right. We've had our own fair share of adversity. I mean, we don't hide from that. It's, you know, if we were around in 2006, we'd have even more war stories.

[00:35:26] And what I'd say is, if I was a new investor or an old investor, and things either didn't go the way that they planned, or maybe I got out of some of the adversity by investing in like 24. And that's where I started my journey. Like, take the time to look back and see, you know, we've just gone through a pretty turbulent time, specifically in multifamily, but even worse for office and retail. Like, study those trends. And that's what I do. We have a new Fed chair.

[00:35:55] Like, this is an amazing time to be working in real estate private equity. And I can't put more of an importance on self-educating, watch podcasts like the one that we do. This stuff is going to help set you up for success as you try to multiply your wealth over your lifetime. You know, I mean, I agree with everything you said 100%. And you as an organization, you guys don't get to a billion plus dollars, you know, assets under management without being battle tested. Right.

[00:36:23] And in fact, to those individuals, sometimes, you know, when I have the craziest due diligence department here, Chris, I almost tell them if they don't have red in the leisure, something's wrong with them as a company. Right. I literally wouldn't believe them. Yeah. You would not believe them. We call this in our industry tuition. We've already paid our tuition tenfolds over in your case. So, and like you said, like, you're expanding as a company.

[00:36:52] Look at where you guys are at. You guys are officially with a broker-dealer. You're in the RIA world now. And that's just the evolution, right, of where you guys are as a company. And I have more power to you guys. So, Chris, thank you. Thank you for joining me, taking the time, educating. For those that are listening, feel free to visit VikingCapital.com. VikingCapitalLLC.com. Please, forgive me.

[00:37:18] And I'll make sure that link, because I said it wrong, is going to be on the bottom of this podcast. So we'll make sure to grab that. We'll put it in there. And if somebody just wants to get a hold of you, right, do you have a consultation link on the website? Yeah, there'll be a consultation link. The invest at VikingCapLLC.com will take you to the head of my investor relations team. Love you. And she will get you either to me or to whomever at the company you need to speak with.

[00:37:47] And that's one thing I do appreciate about you, Chris. So you are an open book. Your phone number, you give it out freely. Your email, anybody could reach out to you. You don't hide or you don't shy away from anything. And for those that are IRA Club clients that are listening for the very first time, I always encourage, you know me, do due diligence. You guys could go to the Investors Row website. I'm sorry, not website, page on the IRA Club website. And VikingCapital is on there. And I look forward to our upcoming webinar that we're going to have.

[00:38:17] And with final thoughts, always learn, educate, alternatives, self-direct, be in control. As I mentioned a million times over, open doors and opportunities for yourself because nobody cares more than you about your financial future. Please visit us at IRA Club Forward Slack Podcast. Feel free to sign up.

[00:38:43] And I always, always, I don't know why my team hates that I always forget to say this. Dennis's latest book, Money Making Ideas with Your IRA and 401K, 15 Reasons and How You Can Reduce Risk, Save on Taxes, Utilizing Retirement Dollars, and Increase Your Returns or ROI, Utilizing a Self-Directed Retirement Account. Until next time, Chris. Thanks, buddy. It's always a pleasure. Thank you, Ramez.